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 LCD and CRT calibration

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leo_arvada

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PostSubject: LCD and CRT calibration   Fri Aug 10, 2007 2:49 pm

Does anybody know the practical way to adjust and calibrate LCD and CRT display, I mean the standard calibration for graphic softwares? Even though I calibrated it, hindi pa rin makuha ang tamang color ng monitor ang printouts usually proofing. Maraming salamat po.
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billy

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:56 pm

Hi Leo,

You need a colorimeter or spectrophotometer like Gretagmacbeth for calibrating a monitor. This is to adjust a the whitepoint and the black point of a monitor. After calibrating, it needs to be profiled. From here you would know the characteristic of your monitor.
What printing specs do you follow? Is it SWOP, ISO coated or japanese or customize. If customized, you need to create a profile of your press.
Then it needs to be set up to your Graphic Application like adobe, corel etc.

cheers!
billy
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presstech

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:12 pm

I agree with Billy. The best way to calibrate your monitor is to use a measuring device such as a colorimeter or a spectrophotometer. The Adobe Gamma in the Windows Color Panel is a calibration software; but it depends too much on the user's visual judgment and lacks the accuracy of a measuring device.

An affordable colorimeter is the Pantone Huey Pro. It should cost less than P10T and is available, I think, at Ideal, Globis and Ynzal. The X-Rite Eye1 spectrophotometer is much more expensive but can also be used to calibrate proofing and final printing devices.

The above devices create an ICC profile of your monitor which should be assigned to the RGB color space in Photoshop's color setting. However, you will also have to assign the ICC profile of your press to the CMYK color space for the monitor to reflect the output colors correctly. You can create an ICC profile of your press using the Eye1 or use a generic profile such as "SWOP Sheetfed Coated" as long as your press can meet the standard of the generic profile.

I just ordered an x-rite eye1, which will arrive about the middle of September. I can give you a demo of how calibration is done when it arrives. Smile
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ibler



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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sun Sep 09, 2007 9:38 pm

I recently went to a Fuji Xerox Roadshow and the speaker told us that prices for spectrophotometer has dropped dramatically. Is this true?
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billy

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Mon Sep 10, 2007 9:42 am

There are color intrument and profiling system being offered in the market today. Be very careful in choosing. for me, I prefer xrite/gretag for two reason, precision and accuracy. I have been using these product for years and I am very happy with the results of my profiles not to mention its being user-friendly features and support from this company.

billy
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Archer



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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Mon Sep 10, 2007 8:15 pm

What are the current prices for densitometers and spectrophotometers?
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presstech

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue Sep 11, 2007 11:18 am

Archer wrote:
What are the current prices for densitometers and spectrophotometers?

I just ordered an X-Rite Eye-1 from Ideal Marketing. Their price is P89,000. With this model, I can calibrate my monitor and digital proofer.
I agree with Billy's preference for X-Rite/Gretag. (X-Rite just acquired Gretag)
X-Rite is available at Ideal and Globis.
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ibler



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PostSubject: !   Wed Sep 12, 2007 10:15 pm

sir presstech, will you be able to check ink densities of actual press output with this equipment?

thanks in advance!
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billy

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu Sep 13, 2007 2:13 pm

ibler wrote:
sir presstech, will you be able to check ink densities of actual press output with this equipment?

thanks in advance!


The eye-one with the Profilemaker 5 software yes, but only after 24 hours of drying the ink. If your purpose is to measure while running, you need a densitometer like D19C or spectroeye with a polarizer (also from Xrite/gretagmacbeth). The polarizer is used in measuring a wet ink. The D19C and Spectroeye has an option of measuring the dot plate, and print characteristics aside from densities, dot area, dot gain. These are good instrument. The one that presstek ordered maybe the eyeone proof package. Eyeone is avery good tool. Ibler, get one from Ideal.

cheers!
billy
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ibler



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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sat Sep 15, 2007 11:27 am

Thanks sir billy! I'll place that on my christmas wish list. im trying to read up on color management so that when i am able to finally buy the tools, i will know how to use them.

OT
I've been going to the different forums and i always come across the book by Fraser "Real World Color Management". Even the reviews for the book are good. Maybe i can start from here and work my way up.
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presstech

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:53 pm

ibler wrote:
sir presstech, will you be able to check ink densities of actual press output with this equipment?
thanks in advance!

As predicted by Billy, the Eye1 I ordered is for calibrating digital proofers. It can also be used for calibrating lcd and crt monitors. I can also use it to profile an offset press. Am still waiting for the delivery. scratch

To check ink density in your press run, you can use a reflection densitometer as mentioned by Billy. You have to use the densitometer together with a color bar which you include in your print. The color bar has solid and screen patches which are measured with the densitometer.

I have 2 Xrites (408 & 418) and a Ihara (ihac-11). Maybe I can sell 1 unit to you cheap. I will have to check them though. Basketball
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ibler



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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue Sep 18, 2007 1:59 pm

That's nice presstech! Will start scouring for dough! heheh Smile
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Luigi

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu Sep 27, 2007 5:38 pm

I have been wanting to calibrate my monitor,proofer and press but the problem is when I ask these companies they try to sell me more softwares.As of now I have a reflection densitometer,and a spectrophotometer and profilemaker 5.anything else do I really need.Also anyone can teach me how to use the spectrophotometer? Neutral
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billy

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu Sep 27, 2007 6:26 pm

Luigi wrote:
I have been wanting to calibrate my monitor,proofer and press but the problem is when I ask these companies they try to sell me more softwares.As of now I have a reflection densitometer,and a spectrophotometer and profilemaker 5.anything else do I really need.Also anyone can teach me how to use the spectrophotometer? Neutral


Hi Luigi,

Is the spectrophotometer you are talking about is the Gretagmacbeth's Eyeone Pro that came with the Profilemaker 5? Wow you got some firepower there. What is the RIP of your proofer? Is it an inkjet proofer.
What are the things you you want to know? You can PM me. May I also know what is your densitometer(brand)? I am free during saturdays.
Cheers!Laughing

billy
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ibler



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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sat Sep 29, 2007 11:38 am

great gear luigi!
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leo_arvada

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sun Oct 21, 2007 12:29 pm

Mga Sirs, baka pwede services niyo for monitor calibration. Magkano ba charges niyo for 2 monitors? Area ko is Makati.
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billy

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:46 pm

leo_arvada wrote:
Mga Sirs, baka pwede services niyo for monitor calibration. Magkano ba charges niyo for 2 monitors? Area ko is Makati.

Contact me and we will schedule it. please PM me.
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Sandman

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:51 am

Hi Leo. Siguro habang wala ka pang immediate solution sa monitor problems mo, sa tingin ko madami din paraan para mabawasan ang problema mo sa pag match ng softproof and hard copies. Here's my 1-peso tip. It may sound stupid, but it might just work.

Meron bang individual RGB guns yung gamit mong monitor? Meaning pwede mo bang i-adjust yung RGB separately? If not, baka meron kang ibang monitor diyan na meron individual adjustment ng RGB. Importante ito pare kung gusto mong maging GRAY BALANCED ang monitor mo.

Secondly, alamin mo ang iyong monitor color temperature whether you are using 5000K, or 6500K...or even higher. Sa tingin ko kung ang ilaw mo sa studio ay normal fluorescent lamp lang (and not D50), 6500K will be a good value to start with. Ang 5000K kasi masyadong ma-yellow, and ang 7000K and up ay masyadong bluish.

Isa pa, kung meron kang mahahanapan ng adjustment ng Gamma...eh baka pwede mo din itong kalikutin. If you're using Windows, ang default niya ay 2.2. Kung Mac naman ang gamit mo, nasa 1.8 ang default gamma niya. Sabi ng lolo ng lolo ko, mas maganda daw siguro kung gawin mo lang 2.2 ang gamma......regardless if it's Mac or PC.

Don't forget to adjust your Brightness and Contrast din.

Pero if you already have a colorimeter, you also might want to set your Luminance to about 85 to about 100 candelas/sqm. Well, you can go more...say... 105 or 110 cd/sq. Pero mabilis mapupundi ang monitor mo. Wag na uy.

Hope my 1-peso tip helps.
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presstech

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu Nov 22, 2007 9:26 pm

Puede rin gamitin ang Adobe Gamma for cost-free calibration. It's found in the Windows Control Panel folder. It's easy to use.

You can also buy a Pantone Huey monitor calibration tool. It's available here for less than P10,000. (Very affordable! bounce )
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Sandman

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sun Oct 05, 2008 5:09 pm

Hi guys. Just want to share some pointers I read from another list

********************

Why D65 on monitors and D50 on lightbox?
________________________________________

Using the process outlined below, the visual white point calibration only
has to be done once, regardless of how many different stock colors you want to simulate.

1. In the D50 light box (presumably a GTI SoftView) place a CMYK proof
containing a large area of pure white (0,0,0,0%) and a CMYK gray scale or
test image.

2. IN Photoshop open the exact same CMYK file that made the proof and assign the profile of that printer to the image. Size it so the screen and proof are about the same physical size.

3. In 'Views - Proof Setup' select 'Simulate Paper White' (very important.)

4. Now adjust both the SoftView's intensity and your monitor's RGB sliders
until the white paper AND the gray scale image match as closely as possible. If you're working on a monitor with no RGB sliders, e.g. Apple Cinema Display, use ProfileCity's ICC Display to manage the white point via the vLUTs.

The misunderstanding on this list was that the monitor was tweaked to one
paper at a time. This is not true if you use 'Simulate Paper White' when
tweaking white, as you are tweaking a screen image that has already been
'loaded' to simulate the color of your actual test stock. If you subtract
that loading then the screen should theoretically be perfectly neutral, and
when the simulation is 'loaded' again to simulate a different stock your
hardware tweaks should remain valid.

If, after using this process, you still need to tweak the monitor to match
different stocks, then one or more of your printer profiles must have a
white point error in its forward tag or an erroneous white point tag. This
is most often caused by not using a UV filter in the measuring device. The
ideal solution is to identify which printer profile is wrong (assuming only
one is) and correct it in profile editing software.


Don Hutcheson
Hutcheson Consulting
(Color Management Solutions)
Phone: (908) 689 7403
Mobile: (908) 500 0341


**************************

Hi folks,

In a nut shell here is the problem. 1) You can't calibrate your monitor to
*spectrally* respond to D50. You can get you monitor to 5000K but not D50.

There is a huge difference between these two specifications 2) Most, if not
all, of the time you are not under D50 lighting! Even fancy light boxes do
not exhibit D50 spectral response no mater what they do in filtering the
light source. 3) Printer profile color matching is based on reference white
point of D50. So profiles are created assuming you will be under D50
lighting which is almost never the case.

The solution: Calibrate you monitor's white point visually to match the
perceived white point of the paper stock under the light booth. People have
found 6500k to match a little closer but that's just preference and not a
rule. Maximize your monitor luminance level so less compensation needed at the light booth in matching perceived intensities between the devices.
That's quick and dirty Cliff notes on the presentation.

Dan Reid
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CIECAM

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue Oct 07, 2008 2:18 pm

X-rite i1 PM5 offers a white point using the white color values of the paper.
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Sandman

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:06 pm

Quote :
The misunderstanding on this list was that the monitor was tweaked to one paper at a time. This is not true if you use 'Simulate Paper White' when
tweaking white, as you are tweaking a screen image that has already been
'loaded' to simulate the color of your actual test stock.

You're right, CIECAM -- we can set the x y z values. Pero better to avoid this method daw according to Don H.
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papaMON



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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Fri Nov 14, 2008 2:17 am

Very Happy
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Sandman

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sun Nov 29, 2009 11:19 am

larrysison wrote:
...Sa tingin ko kung ang ilaw mo sa studio ay normal fluorescent lamp lang (and not D50), 6500K will be a good value to start with. Ang 5000K kasi masyadong ma-yellow, and ang 7000K and up ay masyadong bluish.

Isa pa, kung meron kang mahahanapan ng adjustment ng Gamma...eh baka pwede mo din itong kalikutin. If you're using Windows, ang default niya ay 2.2. Kung Mac naman ang gamit mo, nasa 1.8 ang default gamma niya. Sabi ng lolo ng lolo ko, mas maganda daw siguro kung gawin mo lang 2.2 ang gamma......regardless if it's Mac or PC.

Don't forget to adjust your Brightness and Contrast din.

Pero if you already have a colorimeter, you also might want to set your Luminance to about 85 to about 100 candelas/sqm. Well, you can go more...say... 105 or 110 cd/sq.

Just want to clarify my earlier post lest I be summoned for advocating a less desirable procedure.

Okay. The earlier post is supported by many users especially when one is not using the monitor for critical softproofing. But if one is serious in his work and usually compares his softproof display with physical proofs inside a lightbooth, then everything else changes.

White point: 5600 K - 6000 K

Ideally around 5800K. Not so yellowish; not so bluish. It was found to be better when comparing proof and display especially when matching proofs inside a D50 lightbox.

Luminance at least 120 - 130 cd/m2 (LCD); 100 cd/m2 (CRT)


Gradation: Gamma 1.8 or L*
You will lose image details in the highlight & shadow when viewing with Gamma 2.2. The upcoming ISO 22028 gives a specific L* value as an alternative to Gamma 1.8 which is more adapted to the human eye's tonal response curve.

FYI.
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Alex Dulay



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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Mon Nov 30, 2009 8:20 am

Without the tools, here's what you can do (this is going to work only for CRT but you can try this also with LCD):

1. Patayin lahat ng ilaw.
2. At least warm-up na ang monitor for about 30 min, turn off screen saver.
3. Lagyan ng grey background ang desktop.
4. Open Adobe Gamma.
5. Calibrate (follow instruction, mga 2 feet from monitor ang layo mo)
6. Kung 'di ka satisfied, ulit-ulitin lang ang procedure.
7. Restart computer.
8. Open Photoshop, setup color settings.
9. Open a target image (maraming pwedeng i-download na target image sa net, Google it).
10. Open the target image, assign target working CMYK space.
11. Print the target image using Adobe PS Color management (Google how to do this). Ibig sabihin nito patay ang color management sa printer driver but make sure to choose the right paper/and/or inkjet nozzles quality.

12. Patuyuin ang print-out.
13. visually compare the printout sa target image sa monitor.
14. May 2 options ka to adjust: (1) kalikutin ang RGB control ng CRT to match printout and image on monitor (2) gawa ka ng curve adjustment layer sa PS at tawagin mo itong "soft proof". Everytime na gusto mo i-soft proof any image, i-load mo ang adjustment layer na ito after all retouchings are done. Pero kapag i-print mo na, wag mo isama ang adjustement layer na ito.

ENJOY, Very Happy
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CIECAM

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:31 pm

In judging colors, the visual system use the same system when two reflective color in one booth, but when comparing a monitor and a reflective, the eyes use different sensors . in reflective form, we use the trsitimulus values to compute but not on a display. always remember the opponent signals came into effect when you transfer your eyes to a diiferent proof ( soft proof to hard proof or hardproof to softproof). please be careful in comparing.
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Sandman

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Mon Mar 22, 2010 4:57 am

leo_arvada wrote:
Does anybody know the practical way to adjust and calibrate LCD and CRT display, I mean the standard calibration for graphic softwares? Even though I calibrated it, hindi pa rin makuha ang tamang color ng monitor ang printouts usually proofing. Maraming salamat po.

larrysison wrote:


White point: 5600 K - 6000 K

Ideally around 5800K. Not so yellowish; not so bluish. It was found to be better when comparing proof and display especially when matching proofs inside a D50 lightbox.

Luminance at least 120 - 130 cd/m2 (LCD); 100 cd/m2 (CRT)


Gradation: Gamma 1.8
You will lose image details in the highlight & shadow when viewing with Gamma 2.2. The upcoming ISO 22028 gives a specific L* value as an alternative to Gamma 1.8 which is more adapted to the human eye's tonal response curve.

FYI.

I just want to share with you guys the monitor verification report I got when I recently verified the colors of our brand new NEC wide gamut display having a default value of about 7000+ Kelvin, 300+ candelas/sqm, and a Gamma of about 2.2. I used an EyeOne Pro spectrophotometer from X-Rite to calibrate the display (Please see below):



The measured colors from the NEC were compared to a test chart that represents the colors of ISO Coated v2 (Fogra 39). It looks like this:



We can see from the report that some parameters are not met since the Delta E is over the limit. Also, the gamut it is currently producing is smaller than the ISO Coated v2.

After that I normalized the monitor's settings to the above-mentioned guidelines as advocated by Ugra. When this was done I immediately proceeded with the calibration process. Please see the improvement below. Here all colors are now within the Delta E limit.





Kanina I used the SpectraView Profiler to calibrate naman an older LCD monitor. Ang ginamit kong colorimeter ay Spyder 3. Ganito naman ang itsura ng validation niya:



Kita natin na ang mga colors na nasa green area ay okay. Ang mga nasa labas naman ng green (Row 18) medyo kailangan na ng adjustment, or kung madaming colors out of specs and beyond repair na....di na ito advisable gamitin pang critical soft proof.

Pag may validation system kasi kita mo kung kaya ng monitor mo na ilabas ng tama lahat ng kulay ng ISO Coated v2, Gracol, ISONewspaper26, etc.

Hope this helps.
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wisiwig05

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:16 am

leo_arvada wrote:
Does anybody know the practical way to adjust and calibrate LCD and CRT display, I mean the standard calibration for graphic softwares? Even though I calibrated it, hindi pa rin makuha ang tamang color ng monitor ang printouts usually proofing. Maraming salamat po.
[url]


leo, hi freelance marketing ako before and i have many printer to do my jobs.
but only one printer can do my critical job. located in dasmarinas cavite name United Graphic. meron silang tao kung tawagin ko 4 na itlog si Erwin, Cris, John and Rey baka may kilala ka don sila ang key ng company nila pag dating sa mahihirap na job sigurado mapapawow ka. cheers
what you see is what you get ba.
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CIECAM

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:57 am

@ Sir Larry & Alex,

Good job sir. Thanks for sharing this things. May narereview ako.
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Sandman

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu Apr 22, 2010 10:42 pm

Teka, dagdag ko lang na pag yung bagong iMac ang ica-calibrate nyo ang target candela niyo medyo mataas....between 150 to 180 cd/sqm. Wag niyong i-force sa 130 cd/sqm.

Hi CIECAM. Mami-miss ka namin. Bisi-bisita ka lang pag may time ka brod. Good luck sa bagong career mo. Chat tayo pag may time.
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Sandman

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Tue May 04, 2010 10:31 pm

wisiwig05 wrote:
leo, hi freelance marketing ako before and i have many printer to do my jobs. but only one printer can do my critical job. located in dasmarinas cavite name United Graphic. meron silang tao kung tawagin ko 4 na itlog si Erwin, Cris, John and Rey baka may kilala ka don sila ang key ng company nila pag dating sa mahihirap na job sigurado mapapawow ka. cheers
what you see is what you get ba.

Hi wisiwig05. Watak-watak na yung 4 na itlog. Balita ko yung Erwin nagtayo na ng sariling business na large format. Cris naman nasa call center dealing with Apple products. Rey nasa Avon. Si Jhon naman........andito...katabi ko. If you want to get in touch with Jhon daw his email is rujhsb@yahoo.com
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jhondbaptist69

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu May 06, 2010 2:20 pm

larrysison wrote:
wisiwig05 wrote:
leo, hi freelance marketing ako before and i have many printer to do my jobs. but only one printer can do my critical job. located in dasmarinas cavite name United Graphic. meron silang tao kung tawagin ko 4 na itlog si Erwin, Cris, John and Rey baka may kilala ka don sila ang key ng company nila pag dating sa mahihirap na job sigurado mapapawow ka. cheers
what you see is what you get ba.

Hi wisiwig05. Watak-watak na yung 4 na itlog. Balita ko yung Erwin nagtayo na ng sariling business na large format. Cris naman nasa call center dealing with Apple products. Rey nasa Avon. Si Jhon naman........andito...katabi ko. If you want to get in touch with Jhon daw his email is rujhsb@yahoo.com
[quote]

hi wisiwig05. i guess you sir. Wally?, sir. Tino Lee?, sir. wysywyg? i hate you kung ikaw man si wysywyg pamatay mga trabaho mo walang tulugan. lolzzzzzzzzz...
MP or email nalang tayo sir.
jhondbaptist1969@yahoo.com
thankz....


Last edited by jhondbaptist69 on Thu May 06, 2010 2:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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jhondbaptist69

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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   Thu May 06, 2010 2:21 pm

wisiwig05 wrote:
leo_arvada wrote:
Does anybody know the practical way to adjust and calibrate LCD and CRT display, I mean the standard calibration for graphic softwares? Even though I calibrated it, hindi pa rin makuha ang tamang color ng monitor ang printouts usually proofing. Maraming salamat po.
[url]


leo, hi freelance marketing ako before and i have many printer to do my jobs.
but only one printer can do my critical job. located in dasmarinas cavite name United Graphic. meron silang tao kung tawagin ko 4 na itlog si Erwin, Cris, John and Rey baka may kilala ka don sila ang key ng company nila pag dating sa mahihirap na job sigurado mapapawow ka. cheers
what you see is what you get ba.
[quote]

hi wisiwig05. i guess you sir. Wally?, sir. Tino Lee?, sir. wysywyg? i hate you kung ikaw man si wysywyg pamatay mga trabaho mo walang tulugan. lolzzzzzzzzz...
MP or email nalang tayo sir.
jhondbaptist1969@yahoo.com
thankz....
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PostSubject: Re: LCD and CRT calibration   

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LCD and CRT calibration
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